Ain’t Life Granderson?
Posted: December 9th, 2009 | Filed under: Baseball | 65 Comments »
People have asked me to judge the big trade of the Winter Meetings, and I have been reluctant to do it because Curtis Granderson is one of my favorite players. This is not entirely because he asked me to be his Facebook friend, though I suspect that makes up a percentage of it. I also like the way he plays, the way he carries himself, the way he represents the game. I like the way he wears his socks. I like the thoughtful answers he gives to questions. I like in that in 2007 he pulled off the quad-20 — 20 doubles, 20 triples, 20 homers, 20 stolen bases.*
*Only four men have pulled that off, the least known of those being the underrated Frank “Wildfire” Schulte in 1911. Wildfire led the league in home runs, slugging, OPS+ that year. He never came close to having that good a year again. Willie Mays did it in 1957 and Jimmy Rollins did it 50 years later, the same year as Granderson.
I really like Curtis Granderson, so that probably colors my view of the deal. But since people have asked, I’ll just put my opinion out there: I think the Yankees just made a crazy steal. I mean a CRAZY steal. I mean, hey, I don’t know how the prospects they traded will turn out — none of them seem especially interesting to me — but it doesn’t matter. This isn’t about prospects.
No, there was one star in this trade — and the Yankees got him. You do have to hand it to Brian Cashman and crew. The Yankees played their usual game of buzzard. They flew circles around a team that wanted to dump a contract. Granderson has more than $25 million coming to him over the next three years, which is real money in most places. Fortunately, in the Bronx, they have that kind of money lying around in the petty cash drawer. Granderson will be the 11th highest paid player on the Yankees in 2010. And that’s not including Johnny Damon or Roy Halladay or any other big moves not yet made.
Call it smart business, call it unfair economics, call it whatever you like. The Yankees got Curtis Granderson to play center field. And people who have not been paying attention are about to find out how good this guy really is.
And yes, I know, he has his flaws — people have spent a lot of time talking about those flaws lately. The big one is that he can’t hit left-handed pitching. Last year, his worst year, he hit a dreadful .183/.245/.239 against lefties. And over a career he’s only hitting .210/.270/.344 against lefties — it’s a real issue.
But I would want to make three points:
1. The Yankees annihilate left-handed pitching. They hit .286/.365/.480 as a team against lefties in 2009. With Jeter, A-Rod, Teixeira, … teams are not going to be loading up lefties against the Yankeees.
2. Two of the best lefties in the American League are ON the Yankees. Granderson has over the last few years been in a division with Mark Buehrle, C.C. Sabathia, Cliff Lee, Johan Santana (0 for 12 against him), Francisco Liriano, John Danks. Now, really, there is one great non-Yankee lefty starter in the division in Jon Lester, and a couple of promising young guys — my point is I don’t think lefty pitchers will be as much of a factor for Granderson in the American League East.
3. People are right to talk about lefty/righty but they might want to talk about ballparks too. Comerica Park has consistently depressed Granderson’s numbers. This was especially true last year — it was his worst year, but away from home he hit a much more tolerable .267/.345/.516 with 20 homers. He hit 37 points lower with a slugging percentage more than 100 points lower at home. That’s extreme, but he has hit better away from Comerica every full season of his career. Put him in the pinball machine that is Yankee Stadium … and watch the numbers tilt.
That’s the Granderson side of things. Now, look at the Yankees side. Last year, the Yankees — at eight of the nine positions in the lineup — had a player who had at one point in his career either:
1. Hit better than .330 in a season.
or
2. Hit more than 30 homers in a season.
Or, if you want to put it another way: Last year the Yankees — at eight of the nine positions in the lineup — had a player who had at one point in his career either:
1. Scored 100 runs in a season.
or
2. Knocked in 100 RBIs in a season.
Or, one other way: Last year (just last year) the Yankees — at eight of the nine positions in the lineup — had players with 125 or better OPS+.*
*It is here where I am obligated to point out that the Kansas City Royals did not have a single regular with an OPS+ of 125 in 2009. But to be fair neither did the crosstown Mets — or the Pirates, White Sox, Orioles or Athletics.
The point is — the Yankees had eight stars. The ninth position, of course, was center field, where Melky Cabrera gamely played the beloved YWJDHJ role (Yankee Who Just Does His Job).
Well, now the Yankees have a guy I think is a superstar in center field … and not just any superstar, but a likable superstar who plays great defense (it was popular in New York to call Melky an above average defensive center fielder — well, they’re about to see what one really looks like), who is an excellent base runner, who pulls the ball with power …
Judge the trade? The Tigers got a couple of good arms and unloaded payroll. The Diamondbacks got … well, they got burned, I think.
And the Yankees?
They’ll be calling it Granderson Central Station by June.
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As a BoSox fan, and as much as it pains me to admit this, NY did a fantastic job. Granderson is all class and NY has to project to 105 win team right now. Hopefully the small sample/randomness that are the playoffs will be their undoing. Man, I just hate those guys(he types with much envy)
As a Tigers fan, I can assure you that life right now is anything _but_ Granderson.
I can’t wait for the short Division series which will be the only shot to prevent a Yankee repeat. Until then we’ll all have to endure the New York All Stars Bandwagon ‘10 tour, coming to a stadium near you.
The Yankees annihilate left-handed pitching. They hit .286/.365/.480 as a team against lefties in 2009
To be fair, the Yankees destroy all kinds of pitching. They hit 282/360/476 against righties (marginally worse), so it isn’t exactly like an opposing manager is going to be saying “ZOMG I can’t pitch a lefty!!!”.
But I agree that Grandy is going to get a big boost from his hitting in his new digs.
And as a Tiger fan I don’t know what pains me more: losing Granderson, or the fact that the Tigers are looking to replace him with Juan fucking Pierre.
Are the D-Backs pulling a late-1950’s Kansas City A’s?
Maybe if Wal-Mart didn’t offer such Outrageous Savings and Everyday Low Prices, we’d be able to afford good ballplayers, too.
Who am I kidding? As if Glass has put up a dime since buying the team and quadrupling his investment in 10 years.
Where the heck does Chicago fall on the poll? Is it in the Heartland? Is it in the Rust Belt?
I’d say the Midwest but as that is not an option I don’t know where to place myself. Since I’m obviously supposed to choose one of those two surrogate Midwests I can’t say that my location is not listed so I’m confused.
I nearly cried when I first saw the rumors of him being traded. But even then, I figured it would be to some team like the Angels or the Cubs, which would allow me to root for him.
Now? Now I just don’t know what to do about my favorite player. Maybe I will cry after all…
(My complete thoughts on this matter are here, they are long and drawn out: http://7is.neswblogs.com/2009/12/curtis-granderson-is-still-my-tiger/ )
Also, Jon… I think there should be a third category for “Upper Midwest,” which I think includes Chicagoland (but not the rest of Illinois), Wisconsin and Minnesota. Because I don’t really consider them “Heartland.” I say “Heartland” is Iowa, Southern Illinois, Southern Indiana, Missouri, Kansas, Nebraska and the Dakotas. Maybe Oklahoma and Arkansas. (To round it out, “Rust Belt” is of course Michigan, Ohio, Northern Indiana, Western Pennsylvania and Western Ontario).
Although, truth be told, I prefer to divide the Midwest into “Great Lakes” and “Great Plains” states where the division is a bit more equal (MI, IL, IN, OH, WI in the former and MN, KS, IA, ND, SD, NE, MO in the latter).
Agent Cashman to Curtis:
“As you can see, we’ve had our eye on you for some time now, Mr. Granderson.”
“I’m going to be as forthcoming as I can be, Mr. Granderson. You are here because we need your help.”
“My colleagues believe that I am wasting my time with you, but I believe you want to do the right thing. It is obvious that you are an intelligent man, Mr. Granderson, and that you are interested in the future. That is why I believe you are ready to put your past mistakes behind you and get on with your life.”
Later at the Yankees first home game…
“Do you hear that, Mr. Granderson? That is the sound of invincibility.”
But Poz, aren’t you a bit concerned that Granderson’s OPS+ has been dropping each of the past 2 years since he hit his peak in ‘07? I’m suspecting that Granderson’s fading.
Look at how his road BABIP falling steadily since his peak…
2005: .333
2006: .354
2007: .391 (his best season so far)
2008: .324
2009: .289
…you can’t blame any of that on spacious Comerica. To me, that looks like he’s beginning to fade.
But of course, I’m not taking into account that Yankee Stadium is a hitters park so I should be more specific. Ok, here’s his BABIP in Yankee over his career…
2006: .286
2007: .154
2008: .286
2009: .250
…he’s never hit all that well in Yankee….but of course, that could be due to facing the Yankees pitching, I know. But then… look back at his overall road BABIP again.
I think he’s beginning to age already. I’d have been more cautious if I were the Yanks… tossing out my Austin Jackson for a very good star centerfielder who looks like he’s beginning to fade…ehhh…
Joe, I think you ignored the sabermetrics here. Melky had a much better UZR/150 than Granderson last year, and while one year defensively isn’t a large sample, but that is the first real year that Melky has played center. Gardner is a stupendous center fielder with an amazing arm who has speed and can hit and draw a walk. He won’t hit for power, but he can do everything else. As far as I’m concerned, the Yankees should bench Melky, move Granderson to left, and play Gardner in center.
Devon,
That low BABIP he had last year points out that he was extremely unlucky, not that he’s starting to fade. Indeed, it indicates pretty much the opposite of what you’re implying; he’s probably set for a better year, if he has even mild luck.
Throw in the fact that he’s going from a pitcher’s park to a hitter’s park, and add in the fact that this Yankee lineup is almost historically outstanding, and I foresee Granderson having a comeback season with the bat.
And he’s always been outstanding with the glove.
Damon Rutherford: I think you are confusing Granderson with Milton Bradley.
Sorry if that last post sounded too much like a harsh know-it-all jacka$$. Didn’t mean it that way.
And I could be wrong.
I know that Bartolo Colon, Doyle Alexander, and Larry Andersen would disagree with me…but don’t you always take the established player because the prospects rarely pan out?
garrett Hawk: If not Milton Bradley, then perhaps Keanu Reeves.
“Fortunately, in the Bronx, they have that kind of money lying around in the petty cash drawer. Granderson will be the 11th highest paid player on the Yankees in 2010.”
Familiar territory for Granderson- in 2009 he was the 11th highest paid player on the Tigers.
Kinda think the relatively low BABIP this year was a function of him trying to crank up his power numbers. I think you also see that in his ground ball/fly ball ratio, He hit more fly balls last year than in any other season.
In a Yankee lineup bursting with power I think he’ll get back to being more the type of hitter he was in 07 and 08.
[...] from: Joe Posnanski » Blog Archive » Ain't Life Granderson? By admin | category: Uncategorized | tags: 105-win, all-class, alleged-mistress, british, [...]
Sadly, I agree with Devon on this one.
While I love Granderson and thought his 2007 was awesome, that was 2 years ago and he’s approaching 30 now. His defense has declined, his offense has been plummeting, and while a park change might affect his superficial raw numbers, it will be unlikely to affect his production compared to league average, which is now, well, league average.
If Granderson hits at his career level next year, it’ll be a significant offensive upgrade over Cabrera, assuming Cabrera doesn’t also improve. If he hits at his level from the past 2 seasons, it’ll be a wash, and Cabrera’s 3 years younger (which means he’s more likely to improve).
The fact that one team needed to “dump” a salary to another team, and that “dump” made him the 11th (!!OMG!!) highest paid player says everything you need to know about MLB right now.
How many more years until the Globetrotter-ization of the league is complete?
Dayton, OH – Rust Belt or Midwest? I went with Rust Belt
I wouldn’t say the D-backs got burned. Jackson (just 26 next year) and Kennedy (25 – same as Scherzer but with higher upside) fit right in to a solid young core. If Webb can come back healthy, they’re right there in the NL West race.
I think this is probably one of those trades thats going to work out for everyone (except Arizona -WTF Josh Byrnes?!?!?)
Granderson probably has peaked as a CF. Although moving him out of spacious Comerica Park, where he had to cover the defensive liabilities of Ordonez and Guillen, his UZR should probably extend his life a bit for the Yanks, and obviously, his tendency to pull homers to right is icing on the cake for the Yanks.
The Tigers needed to shed payroll to be able to afford the long term deals for Verlander and Porcello this coming season, and they parlayed Jackson into Max Scherzer who had a 3:1 strikeout to walk ratio for a terrible Diamondbacks team. He’ll fit the Tigers rotation nicely behind Verly and Porcello. The Tigers also added to lefthanded arms to what is a decent bullpen, even if they lose Rodney and Lyon.
I don’t know if Austin Jackson will make the team out of camp, but if he does, they should just give him the job, no need to break him in slowly.
Curtis is still my Tiger. I wish him the best of luck. I hope he his line next year is .324-31-108, and the Yankees get swept in the World Series.
When your LD% goes up but your BABIP goes down (See Granderson, Curtis – 2009) you are unlucky.
I’m with you, Joe – expecting big things next year.
I’m really thankful the Yankees made this trade after winning the World Series.
They had done so little the previous five years that I was beginning to almost forget about them and hate them less.
Hatred renewed.
“And the pony she named ‘Wildfire’
Busted down its stall
In a blizzard he was lost.
She ran calling ‘Wildfire.’
She ran calling ‘Wildfire.’
She ran calling ‘Wildfire.’”
Kyle in AZ, I have to say you gotta be drinking the D-back koolaid if you think Ian Kennedy’s slow stuff has anything close to higher upside than Scherzer’s strikeout arsenal.
Very strong post, Joe. I agree, and yes, my Yankee partisanship colors my opinion. But to be honest, I had considerable misgivings about trading for Granderson, primarily for three reasons–his high K’s (141 twice in the last three years, and 174 in 2006), his struggled with lefties, and the Yankees’ dealing prospects, which they did to their considerable detriment in the 1980s. But Granderson is one heck of a player. He immediately improves the defense. His combination of speed and power will likely shine in Yankee Stadium, which you compare with how Comerica tamped down his numbers. Plus, he’s a good guy–smart, likable, and a hard worker, something that like with Sabathia, Teixeira, Burnett, and Swish, allowed them to fit in quickly in a place where players can and do struggle.
I don’t see that with Granderson. He can get slotted into various spots in the lineup, and the protection of a very strong order will no doubt help him. Very good move by Cashman.
[...] tip to Mike for e-mailing this post from Joe Posnanski’s blog, a strong, detailed entry running through various point about Granderson that reveal the strength of the upgrade the Yankees [...]
I agree with post number 21. At what point do we all just admit all the other teams are pretty much the Generals?
Being a Coloradan, I hate to lump myself in with the Californians, but “America West” seemed to be the only choice I had. Maybe need “West Coast” and “Interior West.”
Jimmy Leyland heaped praise on Granderson yesterday. Among the things Leyland said he likes about Grandy: “He has a nice face.”
RE: the region poll
Ohio is tricky.
Cleveland/Youngstown/Toledo/Dayton can easily be called rustbelt.
Cincinnati is often called the northernmost southern city.
Southeastern Ohio, where the topography is much more rugged (glaciers left most of the state flat, but left SE Ohio intact) is Appalachia like West Virginia and Kentucky
Columbus is an island onto itself, like Austin Texas.
There are over 10 million people in the state, but there are not two easily distinguished regions like there are in New York or Pennsylvania.
So my answer to the poll is I am an Ohioan. Home of John Glenn, the Wright Brothers, seven mediocre presidents and Bootsy Collins. word
Really good deal for Yankees, okay for the Tigers, and absolutely inexplicable for the D-Backs. The Yankees get a guy with quite a bit of power who plays a good CF and has pull power off of RHP. Even if he does decline he’ll still be a useful player for them for a few more seasons. He’s also relatively inexpensive, so if the Yanks want they can still go get Matt Holliday to play LF for them.
The Tigers got quantity, if not quality. Scherzer is a really talented guy, albeit with arm-trouble questions. Austin Jackson doesn’t really impress me, and Phil Coke is Phil Coke. However Schlereth the Younger has some upside as a bullpen arm.
Which brings us to AZ. Kennedy, despite some outstanding numbers in AAA, has some serious questions surrounding him, namely whether or not his mediocre stuff can translate into positive ML results. Jackson is fairly young, it’s true, but Scherzer was younger and quite a bit better. Jackson doesn’t strike many guys out and whose last season was a mirage buoyed by a great first half. His last 15 starts saw an ERA over 5.00. He’s never been a good pitcher at the ML level, whereas Scherzer is coming off a really good season. AZ would have been better off standing pat.
Whoever said Kennedy has higher upside than Scherzer clearly doesn’t know much about baseball. But as far as the entire trade goes, as a Tigers diehard, I’m very happy with the haul. The rotation now has Verlander (who they MUST resign), Porcello (5 years of control), Scherzer (5 years of control), with Crosby and Oliver on the horizon (not to mention Jacob Turner). The bullpen looks strong in the future as well with Perry and Schlereth. Additionally, a lot of payroll will be shed in the next two years. I’d say the future looks bright in motown, although, they still need to develop some position players. As much I hate to see Granderson go, I think it was a smart move. This is one of the few moves Dombrowski has made that can be seen as a positive. He flipped an aging CF who is declining both offensively and defensively and an overrated SP who had two good months for 21 years of control of four players. Good move!
Granderson is a player that I like a lot, and he’s an improvement in CF for the Yanks. But if every year other than 2007 is any indication, he’s still likely to be their sub 125 in OPS+ in their lineup, even if his numbers do jump up in the new park.
How does this effect the Royals? Now the Yankees can dump Brett Gardner on us.
1. Is Brett Gardner and Josh Anderson the same person?
2. I envy Yankee fans (which seem to be multiplying by the day).
I’m a NY native so I chose Northeast, but where does DC (where I live) fit in in the poll. It’s not really northeast and it’s not the south. We need some sort of Mid-Atlantic option.
Edwin Jackson was a Cy Young contender for much of the year, and he’s moving to the NL (though a hitter’s park), and he’s also 3 years younger than Granderson so it’d be tough to say the Dbacks got “burned” per say.
Granderson has a great deal of upside and seems to be the sort of guy that would react well to playing with the Yankees (Incoming “All my life I always wanted to love, to be loved, and to be a Yankee” and all that garbage).
Living in Michigan I have heard it described as the Midwest, Northeast, Heartland, and Rust Belt, at some point in the past it was described as the “West,” though alas it was never described as the South. Given that there’s no “Midwest” option and “Rust Belt” is a relatively new term I’m sure at least some of the poll voters picked the Heartland. What the hell is the Heartland anyway? Everything east of the Rockies and West of the Appalachians? Just looking at the map it certainly looks like Michigan is the Northeast.
It’ll be Granderson Central TERMINAL
I prefer to say that by June 1st I’ll be drinking at the Tribeca Granderson Hotel.
I chose Canada for MN/WI.
Alex (41), I get what you’re saying but that kinda makes it sound like you wanna kill Curtis Granderson.
It seems your poll numbers might be skewed because of “American Heartland.” Is that definable? Someone from say Wyoming might say, “Yeah, I’m from the heartland!” but I’d consider that the west.
Ron @ #36,
Agreed.
Also, Detroit now has only $33 Million in payroll commitments for 2011, and next year’s free agent list will be much better than this year’s.
As a Seattle guy, I would have like to seen a Granderson, Gutierrez, Ichiro outfield, the ultimate “death to flying things.”
BTW, We’re the Northwest, not the West.
“Gardner is a stupendous center fielder with an amazing arm who has speed and can hit and draw a walk. He won’t hit for power, but he can do everything else. As far as I’m concerned, the Yankees should bench Melky, move Granderson to left, and play Gardner in center.”
Thanks, Tropicalmug. That was the best laugh I’ve had all day. OPS+ of 80, son.
Commenters #36 and #46 hit the nail on the head….too many people have characterized the Tigers’ moves as a ‘fire sale,’ when really all they’re doing is prepping for 2011 when the Robertson/Bonderman/Willis contracts come off the books and they have a team option on Magglio (that they’ll very likely decline). That frees up a TON of a money for re-signing Verlander, making a splash in the 2011 free agent market and perhaps making some deals with teams that actually are in fire sale-mode. Economics are bad in Detroit, but Mike Illitch has plenty of money and desperately wants a World Series in his lifetime — he’ll spend the cash, don’t worry.
@49
Everything you’ve said may be true, but what does that have to do with Granderson?
He’s still a youngish star being paid below market rates. This is the kind of player every team wants. The tigers sold one of their most valuable assets. Dress it up any way you want, but it reeks of desperation.
I think it was certainly a good trade for the Yankees, and a great one for the Tigers. And I have no idea whatsoever what Josh Byrnes was thinking.
I’m not sure why everyone is so quick to castigate the Diamondbacks. It seems fans are forgetting league effects and the relative ages of the players involved.
As a KC transplant to Arizona, I watched almost all of the Diamondbacks games last year. It’s a lot of fun seeing Scherzer light up the radar gun and blow hitters away – not to mention the ultracool blue eye/brown eye combo that makes him look like a superior species – but he’s not yet a dominant pitcher. He control and secondary pitches are average to slightly below. He’s behind both Jackson and Kennedy in these respects, which wouldn’t be a problem if he were actually significantly younger than they are.
Earlier commenters have suggested Scherzer is a much better prospect than Jackson and Kennedy, but I think it’s closer than has been suggested. In the ‘08 Baseball America rankings, Kennedy was 45th, Scherzer 68th. Jackson was ranked 4th overall all the way back in ‘04. Clearly Scherzer would be rated the highest today, but it’s important to keep the earlier evaluations of Jackson and Kennedy in mind. Their performance hasn’t done as much to undermine those projections as many suggest.
Scherzer may have better velocity and strikeout numbers, but Jackson had the better ERA+. It’s important not to overrate Scherzer’s non-adjusted numbers (like total Ks). The difference in OPS+ between the two leagues is 100-94, and when you watch National League hitters everyday, you see every bit of that difference if not more.
There is also the perception that Scherzer has a higher ceiling because Kennedy and Jackson have experienced some failure at the major league level, but this probably says little. It’s more important that Jackson had a better year than Scherzer at a similar age (9 months older). Kennedy is younger than Scherzer and holds a career 1.95 minor league ERA. He doesn’t throw particularly hard, but his pitching ability is widely considered to far surpass either Jackson or Scherzer (Haren doesn’t throw particularly hard either and is utterly dominating). Moreover, Kennedy should have a far easier time finding his way as a major leaguer in the NL West than he would have in the AL East.
Arizona essentially got two young starters with very high ceilings for a young starter with a slightly higher ceiling. Schlereth was a pure throw-in, a far lesser talent at a position with much lower leverage (Schlereth was absolutely abysmal last season and is also not as young as many might think). Except for the monetary concerns – controlling Jackson for less time than they would have Scherzer – this seems like a steal for the Diamondbacks.
@ Marco
After 2010 season Granderson’s salary takes quite a jump. So it looks like the Tigers saw a chance to trade him while he still had some value. Look at his numbers the last four years . . . he’s not the star you think he is. He was great in 2007, good in 2008, and horrible in 2009. I know a lot of Tigers fans think, “We were 1 game away from the playoffs,” but the reality is that the 2009 Tigers were lucky to be in contention. I like what Dombrowski is doing. Read the interviews, he’s trying to build a team that is capable of winning for years, not a team that might get lucky in 2010.
Joe, I asked you to be my facebook friend. Does that make me your favorite blog reader?
52– Age for pitchers is kind of irrelevant here. What matters is Arizona gave away two cost-controlled talents for worse players they’ll control for less time. I mean, Jackson is the best pitcher of the four right now, but he’s arb-eligible so he’s not really much of a bargain, and there’s considerable downside since he’s really only put things together once, for half a season. Kennedy is pretty much a #4 if absolutely everything goes right for him.
It’d be one thing if Arizona saved significant money with the trade: they didn’t. Or if they’d gotten significantly younger: they didn’t. Or if they’d gotten significantly better: again, they didn’t. The only way they win this trade is if Jackson rediscovers his first-half form AND Kennedy reaches his low ceiling AND Scherzer flames out or winds up being merely a relief ace, but even then, that doesn’t make the trade any less indefensible.
I’m a Tigers fan and have been for 50 years. I’m just sick over the Granderson/Jackson trade. The last time I can remember a trade that bothered me this much was when Harvey Kuenn was traded for Rocky Colavito. Granderson is not only a great player (yes, last year was a down year and his fielding miscues at the end of the season were baffling, but most players have anomalous seasons at one time or another), he’s been the face of the franchise for the past three years. I thought there was no chance they’d actually trade him. But who knows? In 2-3 years, this may look like a great trade for the Tigers, but right now, I can’t see anything positive about picking up three prospects and a relief pitcher for two All-Stars.
The Yankees are insane. They won the WS handily with a lineup of all-stars, and then they add yet another all-star for no real reason. And now they’re after Halladay, Holliday, Bay… It’s pure insanity.
> The last time I can remember a trade that bothered me this much was when Harvey Kuenn was traded for Rocky Colavito.
@ gar, Don’t you have it backwards? Isn’t that what *Indians* fans say? I mean, trading a singles hitter, even a good one, for a guy who’d hit 83 homers in the last 2 years (in the late ’50s, early 60s when that was a *lot* of homers)? OPS+ of 180 and 133 for Colavito in those 2 years? versus Kuenn, who, yes, had a career year the year before the trade, but then did almost nothing the rest of his career (best OPS+ after the trade, 118, only broke 100 3 times) and only stayed in Cleveland for one year? I mean, this is regarded as one of the worst trades of all time — from *Cleveland’s* viewpoint. The Tigers pulled off a heist in this one.
1) like the seattle guy, I was looking for a northwest option, even if it’s a tough call for some in Idaho. not for me, though — I am from the northwest, through and through.
2) I clicked over to thesoulofbaseball at blogspot and was tooling around (since I hadn’t seen it before), and came across this gem from 2/26/07 in the comments to a blog about the results of the fielding bible awards:
“Just visiting – love the site, but guess what?. Yuniesky Bettancourt, last year a rookie with Seattle is the best defensive ss in the AL.
huh?
oh yeah.
Save this email.
10 years from now, look at this again – Bettancourt will have more gold gloves over the next 10 years than anyone else – if he stays healthy.”
First, I just laughed out loud, because of how far off that prediction is, so soon. and then it made me, I dunno, sad. Because Yuni LOOKED like he was going to be great (yeah, the eyes thing, joe, but also, he totally hustled more his rookie year). how sad that his lack of drive, character (he totally screwed over the man responsible for bringing him to the states and getting him signed), hustle and whatever else could so quickly send him to the bottom of the barrel in baseball. I still don’t know what DM was thinking, and I’m still sorry you ended up with him. but glad he’s out of our hair.
3) yeah, granderson in our outfield would have been a beautiful thing.
[...] Poz mentions a thought I’d been mulling in his piece about Granderson (he makes a Granderson Central quip- [...]
Chuck:
I’m not talking about how the trade turned out, or how the trade looked to the cold analytical eye. I’m talking about how a young boy felt when a player that seemed as much a part of the team as Kaline was traded seven years into his career. It felt particularly bad when the Tigers played sub-.500 ball in 1960. But Kuenn had been very popular in Detroit, and was coming off a batting title. Detroiters loved him, and I was one of them. This isn’t analytical, I’ll admit, but at my age at the time (I turned 9 that summer), I wasn’t much into analysis.
gar,
Okay, I understand what you were saying now. Sorry that I was looking at it the other way around. . . .
P.S.: I was 15 at the time.
Michigan used to be part of the Northwest Territory, along with Ohio, Illinois and Indiana. Everything west of the Connecticut River is the West–it starts in Vermont. I’ve lived in Kansas City since 1976 and still can’t believe the natives think this is the Midwest.
Mike B #63: So, if Kansas City is NOT in the ‘Midwest’ – where the heck is it?
This trade is great for two reasons:
1) Granderson is exactly the type of guy I have wanted the Yankees to pair with Jeter at the top of the lineup for years.
2) It pisses off so many baseball fans (that arent Yankee fans of course), and I thrive on that anger.
I hope I dont pull a Jimmy Rollins by predicting Yankees in 5 in 2010.